Baghdad fears 'Iraqi Hitler'

[Seismic Anamoly]

[MIKE BURN]

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Baghdad fears 'Iraqi Hitler'



Monday, December 13, 2004 Posted: 1116 GMT (1916 HKT)



LONDON, England -- Iraq's interim president has criticized U.S. and British forces for dismantling Iraqi security forces and warned that long-term instability could give rise to an "Iraqi Hitler."



Ghazi al-Yawer said Monday the decision to dismantle Saddam Hussein's defense and interior ministries contributed to the violence and disorder seen since the Iraqi dictator was captured a year ago.



"Definitely dissolving the Ministry of Defense and the Ministry of Interior was a big mistake at that time," al-Yawer told BBC radio.



"We could have screened people out instead of screening them in and this could have saved us a lot of hassle and problems," he said.



In remarks published Monday in the Arabic press, al-Yawer also warned of a replay of post-World War I Germany, when Adolf Hitler came to power, if Iraqis continue to feel humiliated and despondent.



"This could in the long term create an environment in which an Iraqi Hitler could emerge like the one created by the defeat of Germany and the humiliation of Germans in World War I," al-Yawer told the London-based Asharq al-Awsat newspaper.

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On the CNN frontpage right now, remarkable.

[conalrehill]

"This could in the long term create an environment in which an Iraqi Hitler could emerge like the one created by the defeat of Germany and the humiliation of Germans in World War I," al-Yawer told the London-based Asharq al-Awsat newspaper."



I think that Al-Yawer is making an excellent point, and it could be extended to the whole Islamic world and beyond to all developing nations which have been humiliated and destabilised by US activity.



The USA was behind the humiliation and bankruptcy of Germany in the 1920s. The demands for reparations by Britain and other European countries were very heavy because they had to pay back huge loans to US banks and financial institutions. One of the reasons the USA intervened was the possibility that Germany might win and the USA would not get its money back. So the money was filtered straight back to US loan-sharks who must shoulder much of the blame for the rise of Nazism.



There is no doubt that the USA in the 20th century has been history's most amoral and greedy loan-shark. There is no doubt that it did everything it could to weaken European economies and create economic dependency in the third world so that it could rise to prominence and fulfill its imperial ambitions. Then it used the arms-race to bankrupt the Soviets during the Cold War, and now it thinks it is in a position to use military force to subject the Middle East. How it copes with China will be very interesting.



But all the time it is building up hatred and resentment around the world and British-style embarrassment, doubt and anxiety amongst the thinking members of its own population. If that hatred builds up to a sufficient pitch, the whole developing world could seek a 'strong leader' to free them from their humiliation.



Enter a new body of hyper-terrorists who will make Bin-Laden look like the sugar-plum fairy.

[The Master68]

It's amazing how little we learn from history...

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When you argue with a fool, be sure he isn't similarly occupied...

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Music - Organismo Cibernetico (Cybernetic Organism)

[RonOnGuitar]

That's something (Iraq's leadership) for the Iraqi people themselves to decide with their new right to vote.



It sounds like they are obviously enjoying their new right to free speech! After US-led coalition forces removed the Hitler dictatorship, the German people were given the same new rights and responsibilities as the Iraqi people now have to learn to use wisely.

[conalrehill]

"After US-led coalition forces removed the Hitler dictatorship, the German people were given the same new rights and responsibilities as the Iraqi people now have to learn to use wisely."



I'm sorry, this is not a personal attack, merely a pedagogical observation.



A statement like that proves beyond doubt that your knowledge and understanding of modern history and international politics needs to be improved greatly before you can make big sweeping statements like that.



Hitler was elected in a democratic election in a liberal state. People elect dictators under specific conditions, and the conditions of bankruptcy that prevailed in Europe in the 1920s were exacerbated by US loan-sharking in and after WWI.



Democracy is not a guaranteed bulwark against totalitarian dictatorship. Would you claim that President Bush and Senator Teminator are the sort of results one would expect of a nation using democratic rights wisely?

[DreamTone7]

conalrehill - "Hitler was elected in a democratic election in a liberal state."







...talk about "broad sweeping statements"! Really! And it's especially bad when you make them in a fashion that paints an incorrect assesment of the actual facts, while at the same time claiming that somebody else is doing the same. Pot calling the kettle black a bit?



Hitler murdered his opposition to the point that there were no other candidates...a democracy? Really? What democracy is there when there is only one choice? Leaving out pertinent facts such as these really does not enhance your credibility at all, conalrehill.

[conalrehill]

"...talk about "broad sweeping statements"! Really! And it's especially bad when you make them in a fashion that paints an incorrect assesment of the actual facts, while at the same time claiming that somebody else is doing the same. Pot calling the kettle black a bit?



Hitler murdered his opposition to the point that there were no other candidates...a democracy? Really?"





Yes, really. I'm afraid you are ignorant of these matters yet again. There were plenty of other candidates before 1933, despite the murders committed by early Nazi groups such as the Freikorps, including the socialist SPD, which was a popular party up until about 1927, when there was a change in the popular mood.



In the May 5 elections of 1932, Hindenburg defeated Hitler 53% to 37% for the presidency, but there was no majority in the Reichstag for any party; in the July31 elections the Nazis won 230 seats with 37% of the vote and became the largest German party, but dropped to 33% in the Nov. 6 elections; Dec. 1, Kurt von Schleicher replaced Franz von Papen as Chancellor but instability increased.



Hitler made Chancellor Jan. 30, 1933, with the help of von Papen, and sought revision of Versailles system by immediately beginning a rearmament program with the support of industrialists such as Alfred Hugenberg and Gustav Krupp.



In the March 5, 1933 elections, the National Socialist German Workers' Party won 43.9% and 288 of 647 seats in the Reichstag.



The Malicious Practices Act of March 21, 1933, began the mass arrests of communists and socialists, the Dauchau concentration camp was set up March 22 in a former powder milk plant, the Enabling Act March 23 made Hitler dictator and eliminated other parties such as the pro-Catholic Zentrum, radical books were burned May 10. On Sept. 27, 1933, the Nazis blamed communists for the Reichstag fire.



So you see, the arrests and murders of the opposition were carried out AFTER the 1933 elections in which the NSGWP did not even have a clear majority.



Democratic electoral systems are no guarantee against an imperialist troublemaker gaining office. Holding elections in Iraq might have surprising results, unless they are fixed, of course, which is likely to be the case. Bush has only just started causing trouble. 'Democracy' is just a political system susceptible to irrationality and corruption, not a magic potion that will save the world.

[The Master68]

"Hitler murdered his opposition to the point that there were no other candidates...a democracy?"



Where do you get this crap from? Cartoon Network???



Hitler was LEGALLY elected into office.

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When you argue with a fool, be sure he isn't similarly occupied...

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Music - Organismo Cibernetico (Cybernetic Organism)

[conalrehill]

"Hitler was LEGALLY elected into office."



That's absolutely right.



By the way, I'm not Steve Hall.



Steve Hall is my boss, though.

[Seismic Anamoly]

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Steve Hall is my boss, though.

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Am I good or what?



BTW, you have my sympathies.

[DreamTone7]

"Hitler was LEGALLY elected into office."



True...but he then proceeded to murder all the opposition and ensure that nobody else stood the chance of challenging him ever again...IN A DEMOCRACY!!! Sorry, but that is not what I call a democracy. In a democracy, the people are supposed to chose...and Hitler eliminated all possible other choices.



"'Democracy' is just a political system susceptible to irrationality and corruption, not a magic potion that will save the world."



I completely agree.



From George Washingtons fairwell address:



"...reason & experience both forbid us to expect that National morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle. 'Tis substantially true, that virtue or morality is a necessary spring of popular government."



Or, in other words, without the morality provided by religious principle, popular government (or "democracy") will fail.

[Galmin]

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conalrehill - "Hitler was elected in a democratic election in a liberal state."

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[The Master68]

"Steve Hall is my boss, though."



You have my sympathies, also...

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When you argue with a fool, be sure he isn't similarly occupied...

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Music - Organismo Cibernetico (Cybernetic Organism)