MIKE BURN: DVD authoring queries

Master Zap · Joined: 26 Aug 2002 Posts: 93

Well actually I am trying to author a video CD at first, but anyway this is my question:

I would like to author it in such a way that it plays "well" both in PAL and NTSC countries.

Is the best way to do this to author the original file in 24 fps (23.997 really but you get the idea) and then encode the .mpeg as "ntsc film" with "3:2 pulldown on playback" mode turned on? That way the PAL player will probably play it "as is" whereas an NTSC player will apply 3:2 pulldown on playback?

*wondering*

Or should I simply make 2 versions? An NTSC and one PAL? Is that safer? At least for SuperVideo CD's?

/Z

Master Zap - online musician maestro -www.Master-Zap.com

"Those who think they know everything are realy annoying... to those of us who do"

Helge Krabye · Joined: 21 Dec 2001 Posts: 22

Master Zap,

I'm not an expert, but I am sure any DVD player will "translate" your NTSC fromat to PAL when playing your disc. You don't need to create two discs. I would choose PAL (which will be converted to NTSC if that is the format of your TV) because the quality is much higher than NTSC: - And also, why not making a real DVD with menus and 5.1 sound instead of just creating a video CD? Unless you need a lot of copies, you should look for someone with a Mac and the free software iDVD, and you will easily be able to make a DVD with stereo sound playable on oridnary DVD players. If you want 5. 1 sound, this can be done in ProTools or other software mixers, and the encoding may be done cheap (but still excellent result) with Apples more advanced DVD Studio Pro.

Good luck!

Helge K.

Master Zap · Joined: 26 Aug 2002 Posts: 93

Well I'm *starting* with VideoCD just because it's simpler/easier, cheaper media e.t.c.

On a SuperVideoCD you can get all the menus e.t.c. on there too. It's music videos so 5.1 is not relevant at this time... the mixes are Stereo only. Also the videos are made in our garage so the quality difference between SVCD (480x576) vs. DVD (720x576) is probably not visible anyway

The problem is, I did some tests w. making a PAL SVCD and turned my DVD player into NTSC mode (my TV is multisync and handles both PAL and NTSC) and the result looked pretty bad and was line-doubled (apparently something got deinterlaced unnecessarily by the player, the footage is shot progressive)

I'll make some experiments to see what works best.

The videos that will go on the CD will be

this (old)[/link)

this (

this (newest)

/Z

Master Zap - online musician maestro -www.Master-Zap.com

"Those who think they know everything are realy annoying... to those of us who do"

Master Zap · Joined: 26 Aug 2002 Posts: 93

Wait, I figured out what was wrong. I encoded my PAL as interlaced... when I encoded it as progressive, it plays beautifully on my player both in NTSC and PAL mode!

/Z

Master Zap - online musician maestro -www.Master-Zap.com

"Those who think they know everything are realy annoying... to those of us who do"

MIKE BURN

It has advantages sometimes to be late on the board here

MIKE

Master Zap · Joined: 26 Aug 2002 Posts: 93

So that's your professional advice then Mike? Simply make a PAL DVD/SVCD and hope the yanks machines nicely converts it to NTSC w. 3:2 pulldown and the works?

If so, that would save me a load of time and agony!

/Z

Master Zap - online musician maestro -www.Master-Zap.com

"Those who think they know everything are realy annoying... to those of us who do"

MIKE BURN

Most of the Euro DVD players support natively NTSC playback on PAL TV anyway.

You will always run in problems with encoding for the absolutely non-standard poops in the U.S., Japan and Australia.

For these countries you will NEED to produce a dedicated NTSC-DVD to be always on the safe side.

MIKE

Master Zap · Joined: 26 Aug 2002 Posts: 93

Arrgh, don't say that. I was so happy that I didn't have to do that.

My DVD player plays my progressive PAL on my NTSC TV just fine. (Well setting my DVD player and TV in NTSC mode, that is). But you tell me the Yanks #(¤&#(&# DVD players can't do this? You sure?

I have to look at my Region 1 DVD's and see how they are encoded....

I tested CONVERTING my PAL to NTSC (via 3:2 pulldown) and played it on my player. It worked, but was slightly jerky once per second (guess due to 3:2 pulldown normally designed for a source of 24 fps not 25 fps).... and it looked that way played both in PAL and NTSC... while the PAL file played perfectly both in PAL and NTSC mode.

So you are saying the stupid yanks DVD players can't do this?

*depressed* U sure?

Of course the reason I asked I plan to sell this SVCD in the US :-)

/Z

Master Zap - online musician maestro -www.Master-Zap.com

"Those who think they know everything are realy annoying... to those of us who do"

MIKE BURN

"So you are saying the stupid yanks DVD players can't do this?"

.....as a matter of fact my statement is true, or let's say true for the majority of DVD-Players/TV's in the U.S., Japan and Australia, not to speak from incompatibilities with PC-DVD-Units.

I will ask tomorrow (monday) a guy who definitely knows even the weirdest things about international DVD-Encoding about his evaluation of the situation. He may come up with some interesting and solid information regarding your problem.

MIKE

Master Zap · Joined: 26 Aug 2002 Posts: 93

You sure this isn't a "first generation" problem w. older players or something? *argh*

Basícally, you have 5 choices to encode in which makes sense

1. PAL Interlaced

2. PAL noninterlaced (= progressive)

3. NTSC Interlaced

4. NTSC noninterlaced (= progressive)

5. "NTSC Film" which is progressive NTSC at 24 fps which is 3:2 pulldowned on playback into 30 fps

1 is out since my stuff is progressive anyway. I tried 5 and while it works, my 25 fps to 24 fps conversion means simply dropping ever 25

h frame, it is jerky.

I dont want to do 3 or 4 since my original stuff is 25 fps progressive and I dont want to make it NTSC interlaced and already pulldowned on disc, coz that would definitely make a PAL player explode, methinks

2... which is my default anyway since it's my source format... plays BEAUTIFULLY regardless if I tell my player my TV is PAL or NTSC. And no jerk every second either. Looks plays great.

But argh..... keep me updated Mike. I really hate the thought of having to do my own crappy NTSC conversions, I was hoping the damned players did it.

Heck I bought DVD's all over the world and they all played on my player, even when it was set in PAL mode.

Heck, I have DVD's BOUGHT IN THE US which seem to be PAL! (Or maybe they are "NTSC film"). The reason I think this, is because they look WAY BETTER played in PAL. When I switch the player to NTSC, it looks pretty crappy (lower resolution, obvious pulldown artifacts etc.)

*argh*

/Z

Master Zap - online musician maestro -www.Master-Zap.com

"Those who think they know everything are realy annoying... to those of us who do"

MIKE BURN

Zap, I asked my friend who is working for a major DVD-Company over here...

Result is:

You have two choices...

1. Create a DVD, especially for the U.S., Canada, Japan and Australia, dedicated NTSC-Encoding (PAL WON'T work!), 525/60/30frames. Notice that for distribution in the U.S. ONLY Dolby Digital Audio (*ac3-Format) applies and will be played back. For distribution in Europe you can also use the MPEG-2 Audio Format (PAL and NTSC).

2. Create two glass masters, one in PAL/Secam 625/50 and one in NTSC 525/60/30, and let the mastering company glue together TWO DVD Type 10-Disks (5GB). This is a expensive solution for distributing ONE DVD, which surely plays on all TV systems, into all parts of the world (of course the disc has to be flipped for either NTSC/PAL use).

.........The restrictions of television systems do NOT apply to computer monitors. Properly equipped computers can play movies from both NTSC and PAL discs and can decode both Dolby Digital and MPEG Audio.

I hope this helps.

P.S.: Of course DON'T ask me WHY the 'problematic' countries still stick to the (N)ever(T)he(S)ame(C)olor "System" and still know only one audio format...... :cute

MIKE

Master Zap · Joined: 26 Aug 2002 Posts: 93

*argh*

Crappy yanks!

*depressed*

/Z

Master Zap - online musician maestro -www.Master-Zap.com

"Those who think they know everything are realy annoying... to those of us who do"