"Justice" in the USA

bitwhys · Joined: 19 Nov 2004 Posts: 649

so you can pack heat in the States as long as you're not peddling spliff?

shit.

no wonder they've got more prisoners per capita than any other country on the planet. that's the price of "family values", I guess.

maybe he'll meet Tommy Chong and get some pointers on using a web-site once he gets out on appeal (if there is any justice down there). :ohno

MIKE BURN · Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2004 2:51 pm Post subject: Re: "Justice" in the USA

HA!

WELCOME bitwhys!!!!!!! :clap

MIKE BURN · Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2004 2:52 pm Post subject: "Justice" in the USA

Quote:
Wednesday, November 17, 2004 Posted: 9:27 AM EST (1427 GMT)

SALT LAKE CITY, Utah (AP) -- A judge who condemned federal sentencing laws as "unjust, cruel and irrational" said he had little choice Tuesday but to sentence a first-time drug offender caught with a handgun to 55 years and one day in prison.

U.S. District Judge Paul Cassell gave record producer Weldon Angelos the minimum 55 years for carrying the gun -- and one day for dealing marijuana and money laundering while in possession of the weapon.

Cassell said Angelos, 25, will serve more time than rapists, murderers or airline hijackers -- and won't be eligible for release until he's 70.

bitwhys · Joined: 19 Nov 2004 Posts: 649

hey Mike

I haven't checked it out yet but Pot_TV comes highly recommended, including its political analysis.

russky joe · Joined: 16 Nov 2004 Posts: 271

Hey, no wonder we're confused.

We're told we have the right to defend ourselves, then they give us life.

I bet the guy was black.

bbchris · Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2004 4:46 pm Post subject: Re: help me i'm confused

hahaha That POT TV site is very funny!

Quote:
I bet the guy was black

I bet he is too.

The Master68 · Joined: 04 Nov 2004 Posts: 442

55 years MINIMAL??? I've never heard of that.

Must be a midwest thing...

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When you argue with a fool, be sure he isn't similarly occupied...

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Music - Organismo Cibernetico (Cybernetic Organism)

russky joe · Joined: 16 Nov 2004 Posts: 271

Yeah, Master68, those dumb okies are confusing sentencing with Carter's speed limit.

Can't read, half of 'em, that's the problem. Maybe if we cut back the 2,240,000 prison populations and teach the rednecks to read we might get somewhere.

The Master68 · Joined: 04 Nov 2004 Posts: 442

Yeah, that would help...

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When you argue with a fool, be sure he isn't similarly occupied...

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Music - Organismo Cibernetico (Cybernetic Organism)

RonOnGuitar · Joined: 08 Jan 2003 Posts: 1916

Without seeing all the details of this case, Mike, it's hard to tell what sentence should have been imposed.

The judge is complaining about the Federal Sentencing Guidelines. They were put in place in the 80s to try to make sure the same sentence is given for the same crime to all offenders.

Most judges don't like the FSG because they believe that there are many factors that should decide what sentence is given. And they are right - the FSG (mandatory sentences) is just awful because each person and case should be judged on it's own merit.

What doesn't makes sense in this story is the judge complaining. 55 years for the gun (unless he killed someone with it!) doesn't sound right even using the FSG!

The judge can choose to "depart downward" - lessen the FSG prescribed sentence - or to "depart upward" - increase the FSL prescribed sentence. It seems to me that the judge went for a much higher than normally prescribed sentence. He could have "departed downward", giving a much lesser sentence. So I don't think the judge can complain about "having no choice". It sounds like an excuse to me.

This is in a Federal (US) court, not in a state court where the judges have more say in sentencing. I'm guessing that the offender crossed state lines either in selling drugs or carrying the gun - that makes it a Federal offense instead of just a state (local) offense.

The Federal Sentencing Guidelines need to dumped in the trash and this story is just one illustration of why they should be thrown out.

Here's what Federal (US) judges have to go by:

2004 FEDERAL SENTENCING GUIDELINE MANUAL

There's some hopeful news that the FSL will be changed:

New Plan Drafted for Fed Prison Sentences

russky joe · Joined: 16 Nov 2004 Posts: 271

"Mike, but this sentence is just wrong."

Yeah, that's right Hi-Hoe Silver, but you just voted for more and more of this.

You just trust 'em, that's all. You BELIEVE, because that's what you're good at and that's what makes you feel comfortable. That's the problem.

You haven't got a frickin' clue. You're gonna be SO DISAPPOINTED.

Rev9Volts · Joined: 10 Jul 2003 Posts: 1327

he probably had a large amount of crack. so what? he knew the sentance when he started dealing. he knew the risk...

bitwhys · Joined: 19 Nov 2004 Posts: 649

Quote:
he probably had a large amount of crack

using the same standard of evidence, so do you.

Rev9Volts · Joined: 10 Jul 2003 Posts: 1327

too funny another new member with ruskie joe that does nothing but insult people.... i think one of you has multiple labes...

Rev9Volts · Joined: 10 Jul 2003 Posts: 1327

he had 3 pounds of pot with a gun and was convicted of 3 crimes... according to the guide lines 5 years for first and 25 for next two coinvictions.

a gang member with a felony drug conviction from years past.

he was offered a plea bargin deal of 16 years and turned it down...