Do good artists without money or contacts

HKRockChick · No More Peas! Joined: 25 Nov 2003 Posts: 1513

have any hope of being heard?

Yeah, I know its not only money, its talent, persistence etc, and there are many success stories, but it seems to me that unless you have a computer, an internet connection, some gear, money for studio rehearsals, or whatever, the competition is so fierce, its getting really difficult for money strapped artists to be heard, however talented????

Thoughts?

bbchris

Yeah of course they can be heard! It's something called "Playing Live" :rollin

HKRockChick · No More Peas! Joined: 25 Nov 2003 Posts: 1513

but they have to rehearse first, audition etc etc, gain credibility. I think promo these days is quite expensive? And what if they live in a musical desert??? :wgrin

Of course I know it can be done if there's a will. It just seems like real talent never surfaces these days, drowned out by wanabees with money, time and persistence...(yes, persistence is a big and necessary part of everything so I'll never grudge them that).

bbchris · Posted: Wed May 19, 2004 2:47 am Post subject: Re: LOL!

Are you thinking of anyone in particular Debbie? It's hard to give general advice as you say it all depends where you are, how talented you are and how much you want your music to be heard. I know many a talented musicians who don't have internet access - even others with NO COMPUTERS!!! They seem to have lots of time cause they don't hang out on Internet bulletin boards... :laugh

RonOnGuitar · Joined: 08 Jan 2003 Posts: 1916

Quote:
have any hope of being heard?

Heard by whom, Debbie?

(That's a serious question, in case ya thought I was just being a smartazz, lol!)

HKRockChick · No More Peas! Joined: 25 Nov 2003 Posts: 1513

I was thinking of several people whom we knew online who didnt have access to a computer suddenly because of money worries, people with real talent. Then I was thinking of the britney spears of this world... It seems that you have to have money or somebody to invest in you somehow... I think in older times when there was sheer leg work to be done, anyone could do it, but now there are short cuts and those who can afford it, take it. Not really an equal playing field... just my thoughts. I think this is especially so in the music industry. :dunno

bbchris · Posted: Thu May 20, 2004 1:25 am Post subject: Re: actually

In Britney's case, she's been singing and doing shows since she was 7 years old. So she has worked her way up to the top and has fallen somewhat ungracefully.

The other musicians you mention, depends where they live and how motivated they really are. Motivation is what moves them to do something, taking action is what makes things happen. I've given advice to musicians who just don't bother doing anything I've suggested and then watch them doing what I did when I first started out playing live; making all the mistakes I did etc. hahahahaa

Mentoring a musician isn't easy - in fact mentoring anyone isn't easy - if the pupil insists on knowing better despite lack of experience.

I think the best way you can help these musicians is to encourage them to pursue their musical dreams. Britney pushed forward even when she lost competitions, lost auditions, got ripped off, got laughed at (learnt a lot and is now a great manipulator of the press). Music business is not for the sensitive-to-criticism folks. I've discovered that's how many super-talented musicians end up doing other things cause they can't stand the heat OR the hard work.....

A female singer I know very well once said to me "Why is Alanis Morissette famous? That should be ME!" hahahahaha I then had to explain that Alanis toured USA for THREE years with Jagged Little Pill - building up her fanbase and slowly selling albums whilst living out of a band van living on peanuts. How many people would really take that plunge even today??!

Debbie, there are no short cuts in the music biz. Everyone pays their dues, albeit in different ways.

Seismic Anamoly · Joined: 22 Aug 2002 Posts: 3039

Quote:
...in fact mentoring anyone isn't easy - if the pupil insists on knowing better despite lack of experience.

You're a natural born teacher, babe.

HKRockChick · No More Peas! Joined: 25 Nov 2003 Posts: 1513

Quote:
Everyone pays their dues, albeit in different ways.

Very true.

Agreed about the mentoring, but mentors can learn too... as someone in the training biz, I know that I'm constantly learning, from all sorts of unexpected places heh

bbchris · Posted: Thu May 20, 2004 5:07 am Post subject: Re: LOL

Of course mentors continue learning. :banana

RonOnGuitar · Joined: 08 Jan 2003 Posts: 1916

Well, Debbie, as we all know there's no one magic formula - if there were, we'd all be sipping it!!

And for every way there is to go about it, there seems to be a total opposite that worked just as well. Chris cites touring as being important, and it is. But then you have Shania Twain who did nothing but CDs & videos for a few years before touring (got a lotta ppl peeved cause she wasn't doing it the "usual way",lol). But she paid a lot of dues along her way.

The reason I asked "heard by whom" was to elicit who might be your specific target in mind. The only people who matter in the end are john/jane doe who listen to the radio or other common music outlets. But to get to them an artist usually has to be "heard" through a number of other people.

I think this is where making genuine and friendly contact with people who have some influence is important. Where you'd actually have a Rolodex of people you've contacted and keep up with them. As you know, it's not as easy to make connections in HK as it is in LA or NYC.

In LA or NYC you can knock on a hundred doors in on day. And most of them will be elicit the "thank you for the CD and promo material, we appreacite your submission" formulaic response.

I'll have an 'Anthony Robbin's moment' here,lol, and recycle one of his points - you know Col Sander's of Kentucky Fried Chicken? When he retired and got his retirement payment of $100 a month, he decided it might be a good idea to augment that generous amount. All he had was a really good chicken recipe. So he went the rounds of restuarants, offering to let them use his recipe for a certain percentage of the sales. AR notes that not too many people were overly impressed by an old fat guy who looked like Santa Claus in a white suit making such a stupid offer, hahaha! But Sander's kept on knocking on the doors and on the 1009th door somebody said "yes". He believed in what he had (the recipe) to just keep on knocking for as long as it took.

Music is art, but it's also a business. The musician has her/his "recipe and they have to know who to whom to make their pitch. The more specific you can be with yourself, the better. That is have specific a written end goal(s) and breaking down the steps to acheive it(them). e.g. if you ask a great many aspiring musicians, actors, singers, etc what their goal is they'll say something like "to be a rich superstar".

That's a meaningless goal, because it's undefined.

To say "I intend to acheive a $5 million, multi-year contract with a major label" is a defined goal. Then the person has to break it down into the from here2there components.

For some people the first component will be to learn to sing or play an instument! For others it will be to make 2 good contacts within the major labels during a certain week.

Because when you look at it as a whole, it surely appears a daunting, if not impossible task. But broken down into one specific task each day (for instance), it becomes more acheivable. Not only has a person tangibly moved toward their goal, but in addition after the person has did A, they think, "well I can tackle B", then C doesnt seem as tough. Self-confidence is built up with each accomplishment, no matter how small it may seem.

In the "I just wanna be a superstar" thoughtline the person goes from A-Z in total dyslexic fashion.

By the way, I'm not refering to you at all, Debbie, as the superstar wannabee, lol. And, actually, I think that's more common among guy musicians;think a bad version of Spinal Tap. I'm stressing the concept of looking at the desired end and quanitifying the individual actions involved. But I think that's the best M.O. no matter what anyone's goal(s) may be.

Then there's the element of luck, dumb luck, fate, being in the right place at the right time, etc. that sometimes factors in. There's also those who've learned to create their own luck!

The one thing I would recommend to someone, and it's been covered here, is for a person to look at whom they look up to as artists. Find out what made/makes them tick and pick up on any commonalities among the artists. Not to be a carbon copy of the artist, but to replicate what makes them tick.

Yiiii, it's way too late/too early for me to be so verbose!!!!! hahahahaa!! Just some meandering thoughts, anyhooo...